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Forums \ Strategic forum \ Build Orders that important ?
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3 months ago

CrackdowN
Build Orders that important ? (686 reads, 22 replies)
Hi I just asked myself if BOs are really that important ?
I mean if I don't make big bullshit or so but if I do the most things right but change the timing and so on.
Does this really affects on the game ?
I think no because most of my games go over 12 minutes and there the BO says nothing just your macro & micro and so on.
What do you think ?
BO important ?
Less important ?
Important but not that heavily ?

I hope you understand what I wanna try to tell ya people ;)
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3 months ago
#1

EsX_Raptor

 (Replay management - SC)   5
You're misunderstanding the true meaning of BO.

A BO is just simply a starting move you make to develop a certain strategy the most efficient way it can be developed.

Think of it as the first moves in chess, you won't move the pawn at A2 or H2 (the ones at the borders) just for the sake of it. But rather you move the ones in the center to gain control of the 4 center squares so you free up the bishop for furhter attacks and can castle and develop your positions later.
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3 months ago
#2

LML

 (Forum moderator)   18
think u change the timing so much that your fax comes out 15seconds later than usual, 15 SECONDS! that would be so damn much, goons would be there for ages then when tanks pop out.
so yes, it is damn important if you opponent does a rly good timed aggressive strat.
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3 months ago
#3

Eddie_Tyler

   2
Back when I started playing more seriously I learned some BOs instead of just building as I see fit. The change in my gameplay was great, I improved much and started winning some games. So yes, they are very important. ;)

As described above, a late siege tank can win the game for your protoss opponent, too late cannons can screw you up against a 9 pool zerg, etc.

Though at some level you can not get very far behind, that's true. But it effects the game and these changes can actually cause a loss.
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3 months ago
#4

Lim.Yo.Hwan

   1
build orders are very important for beginners who dont understand the game yet.
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3 months ago
#5

Izraphel

   7
obviously they're not so important if both of you plan to go for some standard bo and then just sit in your base and macro (although someone with a macro-adjusted build order would have an advantage in that situation) but if you plan to early reaver drop him or something, you better get every tiny detail right to do enough damage to make the strat actually worth it. if you're sloppy you will just go for an expensive build that doesn't work and only hurts yourself, putting you in the defensive position allowing him to exp etc.
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3 months ago
#6

waRmt

   2
watch the VODS of spirit that artosis provides. listen to dan lee's comments. G5 vs Sea.Really, the whole game is based on build orders. even if the game goes passed that point each build order establishes a certain style for the rest of the game. this can be extremley important at all levels of the game because EVERY little thing ultimately matters.
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3 months ago
#7

xyberkids

   6
It's probably not important if you don't think it's important
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3 months ago
#8

TM-King-

   1
bo is very important
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3 months ago
#9

duellist

   2
50% wins are BO wins , if u play with same skilled guy as you are bo is a lot important, experience & so as well
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3 months ago
#10

CrackdowN

   2
Okay thanks guys :D
Thanks god I am a Terran player.
For me they have the easiest BO to learn.
It's just my impression so don't execute me
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3 months ago
#11

Tavo_Nova

   2
well for me its not that really important, as i have a basic opening in what ever opening my opponent do, but i guess so does the others, but its true at what the above say mostly (not all) for beginners its important, but as you go on the game, you tend to like memorize it with your own fingers and sight, as what to do depending on what your opponent do, so yeah, its also quite important but if you focus on bo and doesn't bother to micro then it could give you a big disadvantage, so more or less, less or more, its part important, but even if you follow a good bo that counters your opponents bo, it all depends on who use it, as even if you do the right timing, right mechanics, but if you don't know what to do with it, just that you know it counters this or that, then its over ^^
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3 months ago
#12

080485

   11
Where these guys keep coming :p
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3 months ago
#13

PdK.Scary

   5
lol
#0 is on crack
anyway i still understand what he was thinking when made the thread.
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3 months ago
#14

JinnyShield
Build Order are just to let you start the game. that only means if your experienced though. unless you decide to go for cheese but other than that, if u look at the korean progamers they all know latest build order and get same amount of practice. its all how they play and how they use the map well against your opponent.

Thats why if you look at all the foreigners vs koreans in spirit league, foreigners lost cpet for fenix vs idra. foreigners build orders are good but like daniel lee from estro said, they lack macro and make these small mistakes that makes you lose the game.
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3 months ago
#15

barnbum

   3
As a very bad player, I get along on 2 Terran build orders, a 2 rax for zerg and a rax-2factory build for Terran and Protoss opponents. I wonder if I really need any others at this stage, as a bottom feeder low D- player.

In any event people seem to have no trouble getting zerglings to my base before the first marine hits the ground, which is irritating to say the least. If they have the APM to micro the zerglings and continue their build, I have an awful choice- try to deal with the lings and get behind on my BO, or ignore them and lose the SCVs that trying to build things, which gets me behind on my BO.

If the attack is unskilled and the lings dive right into the mass of SCVs mining I have no trouble clearing them, but otherwise...


Is there a way of dealing with a rush that is being microed all over the base, picking off construction workers and outrunning the marines, that does NOT require high APM? You can't just send your lone marine out there in the open to attack 6 lings. He'll get overrun. Arg.
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3 months ago
#16

champignones

   3
BO has to do with everything, is so important to develop what you are trying to achieve and to do it more efficienttly , you have to learn all the BO´s against all your opponnent and what BO is best for countering your opponent BO. you also need to know their timing to know if you made the mutas too late, etc. its helpfull in other stuffs like if you go for economy , if you go for low eco, if your teching for some kind of strat etc, you need to know when you have to stop producing this, when to start working on that, when to scout, etc. so BO is so important, watch rep and work on them playing at battlenet, after that go an enter ICcup if you like, i garantize you after that you will have progress.
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3 months ago
#17

SCTV

   4
your build allows timing for certain units of which you opponent may not be able to prepare or adapt against!

it's like "stone, paper & scissors", imagine you have all three and your opponent only has "stone & paper" who would have the advantage at what time?

It depends on many things! #EDIT

normal players:
But I'm slowly but surely getting bored with guys not touching each other for 12 minutes macroing away their fe- sim-city just playing by the book, like a ritual!
As if they really understood what they where doing ....and that, all though the rest of the game play clearly shows, that they don't have a clue .... ending up just emulating pro replays/vods! Playing crap games with no action and a ritual GG at the end!

Maps & style:
Most players learn to play a macro based counter defensive style of play nowadays, meaning: If both do the same style of play for 12 minutes you have no real early game. Anyone that does a wrong move or mistake during this period will lose the match. with other words SC has become boring, not only to play but also to watch .. That's also why the new Pro-maps are getting so gay! It's only to animate the the players to cut the "don't move until" crap!
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3 months ago
#18

walen

   4
when i play for fun, i don't care about bo, but when i bet with my friends and i have a goal, i usually make early scout + adapt BO, and that way you look so pro. LoL!
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3 months ago
#19

orbs

   1
2008-08-29 06:41:09, barnbum wrote:
Is there a way of dealing with a rush that is being microed all over the base, picking off construction workers and outrunning the marines, that does NOT require high APM? You can't just send your lone marine out there in the open to attack 6 lings. He'll get overrun. Arg.


Block.your.ramp! Blocking depends on the map, though. On ramp maps, getting a marine with two SCVs in front to block your entrance can buy you enough time to get another marine out.

On maps w/o ramps in your main like Blue Storm, walling in is the most common strat against early lings.
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3 months ago
#20

Kakashi

   1
BO is the MOST important thing. BO is basic for whole your game , it is first the most important thing to learn before u start thinking about anything else ;


By build order I mean first 7-8 minutes of the game rly , everything matters there ..

Even slighest details , I ll give u an example : when u do 12 hatch in zvt and scout with 9 drone - it slows your lair and therefore mutas by 20 seconds. You know how much 20 seconds is. Progamers scout with 12th drone

In fact going for 9 drone scout makes u loose the game somtimes. Hilarious :) ? Every progamer would scout with 9 drone cuz its save and u ll always get to see what your opponent does but that 1 drone hurts your eco too much .. its important to understand how details affect the game, cuz even the smallest detail affects your BO.

Most ppl loose games JUST because their BO was innapropiate/not map suited/executed wrong.

Your macro is effect of your build order thats why its so important.
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