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ret: Micro is almost non-existent in StarCraft 2
Posted by Patrik "Raistlin" Hellstrand 2 years ago
Jos "ret" de Kroon has posted his first blog on his new team LowLandLions' website. Ret is the second highest ranked foreigner in the StarCraft scene.His blog gives us a rundown of what he thinks about the current StarCraft 2 beta. He is irritated with the Terrans especially.
- It really felt like Terran was much harder to play than the other 2 races before the first two patches, and being a Random player it was frustrating losing over and over while playing Terran, says ret.
He also states that micromanagement in StarCraft 2 is almost non-existent compared to its predecessor StarCraft: Brood War.- Micro was always an element in which you could separate yourself from your opponent and take the lead in a game. I feel it wasn't really there in SC2. It almost feels like you just build up an army, try to scout and counter your enemy's units, and then just attack and hope for the best, says ret.
Then, he expresses how he misses the map control element from Brood War.
- You constantly have mind games and small battles going on from the start of the game. But maybe this is just because we haven't learned enough about the game yet.
He does point out, however, that a lot of the balance issues have been fixed with the two newly implemented patches.- Terran was made a lot stronger and all the races seem pretty, even with the limited information we have on how to play exactly. In the next few weeks, we will see how the balance holds up, and whether or not people are able to find cute tricks or strategies still hidden in the game to create challenging gameplay and tense/exciting games of SC2.
Make sure to catch ret's livestreaming hours available at Livestream.com.
| Links |
| LowLandLions.com - Full blog entry |
| Comments \ Paging |
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| man... so many with beta keys... LOL |
| I'm glad ret feels the same way I do, since people will actually take his opinion seriously |
| The micro with the zerg in the current version of sc2 is pretty crap since the zerg units when massed, tend to glue them selves together in large stacks, specialy in choke points of the map and they are very hard to control if you want to avoid storms and stuff. For the protoss and terran, its pretty much the same problem but for them, its generally a good idea to have those units stacked like that, at least most of the time. Zealots with charge are pretty hard to micro in my oppinion since they are pretty hard to select with their charge spam. I didnt try this by manualy casting charge though and disableing the autocast.  |
| #99 U have to be D+/D player, and u dont understand sc bw. All this thnigs that make game easier will kill game very very fast just like wc3. If blizzard want to make new "immortal" game like sc bw it must add many things that we have to learn how to use it by playing many many games. Now I dont see anything like this besides remember what kind of armor have unit. ITS BORING .... |
| ret is saying that cauz he lost his beloved muta packing & mass click + hold button. |
| Lachesis, you have no clue why wc3 died. It's certainly not cauz of the easiest macro part... In fact micro IS wc3 strong point. WC3 died cauz of it's own concept: creeping (which indue a lot of luck with itemdropping and creepjacking), heroes (imbalance), shitty blademaster (lol?), tower (way stronger than in any other RTS made by blizzard) and all in all a great difficulty to balance the game (due to everything i have said + 4 races) which led blizzard to patch 10 times a month, disturbing all build orders and thus destroying part of the meta game each time. |
| People that say that wc3 has no micro and its an easy game are fucking retards. wc3 scene is still alive and there is a lot of ppl that still play that game the only reason i see for that game to die is the luck factor in it and the mass hackers that blizzard dont care about anymore. i bet all the sc1 players here that whine for their micro sending workers to mine and buying from 8 rax would suck hard in wc3 microing their hero+army in different groups and use items right. if wc3 was so easy game noobs could beat progamers but in fact progamers can crush hard a semi pro and win him in few mins. also i didnt play sc1 at any level and i kinda suck in it because i didnt try to be good at it but i can tell that in sc2 ppl that will master the microing part (pulling back units that being focused, army split, different groups for army types, attacking at 2 or even 3 places at the same time etc etc...) will win way more than someone that thinks that all you have to do is make one group of 200/200 and send them. dont get me wrong in my opinion the micro you can do in sc2 is low atm but you still got things to do and i would like more stuff to micro and also the counters right now are too hard so you cant really micro vs that because you get raped hard. in my opinion the micro things that should be improved should be involved with the army and not things like sending worker to mine and build manually from 8 rax which is stupid. |
| http://art2stuff.blogspot.com/search/label/Starcraft ALL ABOUT SC on our BLOG! |
| After i read so much crap here, i will add my two cents. Starcraft 2 would need complete remake to be similar to SC1 and there is no way they can fix this with updates/patches/corrections. I don't have the beta key, so i can't really judge now. All i see now from VODS really disappoints me as SC1 player. SC2 looks like shit, units are one clumped ball and the game is not similar to SC1. As many people here said - it is different game. I will just wait for the release and give it a try. If i like it, i will stick with it. Anyways it makes me sad, that this game is so Warcraft, i can't believe it is called Starcraft 2. All the coments from Warcraft players here proves me right. Unfortunately there will be no real Starcraft again as some people expected/hoped for... The SC2 will definately be huge and played by many people, but for me it is disappointment. Still have to repeat that everyone should chill and just wait some more time for the game. |
| #109 true ! |
| well said #109 :) |
| I ain't a wc3 player, i played both game online and I stopped both. You are just saying bullshit, you just don't understand why wc3 died, trying to say it has something to do with less macro than sc1. Let's stop comparing wc3 & sc2 when you don't know how wc3 is played. Anyway, on the other part i think what you say is true, it is a mistake to destroy some of the greatest feature of sc1, especially this idea of getting everything easy, focussing on spell, destroying the macro part, etc. And it will not be fixed by patching, nerfing & uping units every two days. |
| Ppl that dont like SC2 keep complain... But give me the key! :) |
| hahaha so typical sc needed only skill because it was sooo old, now where you can set numbers for buildings and the 13 units limitation as well as the the low resolution are gone the game is only for lowbirds. WC3 is now the only rts game that needs skill. |
| #114 dude .. look at what you are posting .. its like your saying your not gonna eat shit yet you have shit all over your mouth .. |
| I dont get why idiots claim wc3 is harder or requires more skill then sc1. Sc1 requires a lot more talent then WC3 and SC2 combined. It is just a raw RTS in 2d and nothing can compare to its mechanics. Starcraft Brood War is the best RTS game ever created and everybody knows that. 12 years since this game was made and its still alive and competitive. Its also very very balanced. |
finally i try sc2, and in disappointed  |
| wait till ur able to play the game. i'm playing it and it already feels good. for any judgements its far too early (in points about micro,macro straegies) and for those who doesnt even play it right now.. shame on you for even trying to judge this game! |
| #116 It's not the same type of skill needed for sc1 & wc3. Look at the player Sky, good terran player in sc1, and one of the best in wc3. His way of playing is so like sc: mass macro, map controlling, huge apm. But still, sometime he loose against guy with 160-200 apm because these guys just micro their units more. APM in sc1 is really important while it is not in wc3. |
| Micro in SCBW just arose because of low AI of game mechanics etc.... Nowadays there is a much better technology and more intelligent behavior of games, so it is clear that many possibilities of micro will be eliminated in SC 2. It is really sad but we already know that there will never be better RTS than SCBW.... |
| Ret is almost none-existent in SC2 :D |
| starcraft 1 just spamming, you dont care if youre losing units as long your are fast enough in wc3 if youre losing your hero that the game is over. |
| #122 yes, but you will never lose him, because he is immortal... :D |
| #122 W3 u can play with 30apm and one hand on your balls without any problem, since theiresnt macro, so obviously its micro based, but a trash poor micro based game to be honest, now try to play starcraft with you guys 30apm, and try to micro starcraft units, dont compare W3 with SC plz, your game died so fast to a FUCKING UMS (DOTA), its like Starcraft dying by TURRET DEFENSE or TEAM MICRO DEFENSE, u can be sure, this WILL NEVER HAPPEN, w3 is ridiculous, end story. |
| too early to judge a game, it's in its beta stage come on |
| well i dled the beta 2 days ago i think this time blizz fcked up really big. at first i was against the game. the battlereportsd changed my mind but im seein i was right the game is boring now. its all about who has more units. interface sux i dont want to compare but in sc1 the buildings in your build tabs had a unique look. now u cant understand what they re like. some units are really op . well they ll balance it . thats ok but still the overall is very low. its sad. sad... very sad. |
| I really don't see how micro is lessened in SC2. About the biggest change is that you can control group more than 12 units at a time, which means that big forces are easier to handle. Using protoss is pretty much exactly the same. You still need to psistorm, you still need to cycle your stalkers or zealots if you can. Really toss tactics haven't changed much at all. There's no more reaver micro, that's about it. But you still need to micro colossi if you expect them to survive. Even a smart zerg plyaer with roach burrow can do some nice micro if you're quick enoug,h you can burrow a wounded roach in battle and let it regenerate. Granted we don't see this much from Z players anymore, nor surprisingly do I see zerg attempting to storm dodge the way they did in SC1. I suspect we'll see more of that though. Not to mention I see so many games in ZvT that could be won with infestors and fungal growth, but the Z player just makes roaches and hydras. Zerg is likely going to be more micro intensive than in SC1. As far as terran, not having a metal build seems to have cost the race some micro. Pretty much Terran seems to require the least micro now, as most terrans do nothing but marauder/marine/medivac. None of those units really take much micro to command which tends to reduce terran micro to only a few choice maneuvers like when to focus fire on a colossus. TvZ really feels micro-free for terran, since you're basically just throwing infantry at waves of zerg roaches and hydras. Neither side really has priority targets to focus fire, so it's mostly just a matter of stimming and hoping for the best. TvP still requires timely use of ghost EMP if you want to be successful. |
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