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| Danielle 'dmoongirl' Andersen Interview
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Danielle 'dmoongirl' Andersen is finally starting to get the recognition she deserves. The 27-year-old wife and mother from small town southern Minnesota has been one of the top online cash game players around battling against many top players at $25/$50 No Limit Hold'em 6-max. She kept her identity under wraps for years, but now with her featured role in the upcoming "Boom" poker documentary, the cessation of online poker in the U.S., and her bankroll stuck on Full Tilt Poker, she is taking a more visible role in the poker community. Read about her fascinating journey in this in-depth interview of how this young woman from New Ulm, Minnesota has developed into one of the most feared poker players anywhere.
How did you start playing poker?
It was when I was in college at Illinois State University with my then boyfriend, now husband. My boyfriend was a lineman on the football team there. I didn’t know the rules at all. I kept getting really frustrated when I didn’t hit a straight and I didn’t know what was better a straight, a flush or a full house.
We had met and dated in high school. He had become an avid poker player after the Moneymaker boom, like lots of other young guys at that time. In college, we had a number of mutual friends and they were always ignoring me so they could play poker. I decided if I wanted to spend any time with them, I better learn the game.
Did it become a competitive thing between you two?
It wasn’t competitive at all. It wasn’t a serious game, I mean we each wanted to win but we really had no clue what we were doing. In the beginning, we didn’t even know about structure and blinds. We played $5 Sit ‘n Go’s with no structure at all, just playing until someone won all the chips. Sometimes it took 8 hours, playing until five in the morning. We’d Get up and go to class at 8 a.m. and then do it all over again.
When we first started playing, I was terrible. But then all of a sudden I started winning frequently. It quickly became apparent that for whatever reason I had a knack for the game.
What do you account for your early success?
To this day I don’t really know why I’m good at poker. It’s weird, I just seem to have an instinct for the game. I seem to know what my opponents are feeling and how to react to certain situations. I’m good at classifying people from the few showdowns I see into what type of player they are and adjusting my game to take advantage. I’m good at adapting to the flow of the game.
When did things progress from your home games to playing online?
When I starting winning regularly, my boyfriend wanted me to play online poker but I thought it was a terrible idea. I had the perception that all online poker players were degenerate gamblers. It was just a black hole that you were going to be sucked up into. I also had a pretty strong history in my family of gambling addiction and I don’t enjoy gambling or taking big unnecessary risks. I don’t think it’s fun to buy a lottery ticket. Nowadays I can enjoy playing a bit of Blackjack or Pai Gow where there is a bit of decision making and skill to the game, although it’s just for fun and I realize it’s a long-term losing proposition. But I would never play for significant sums.
My boyfriend was persistent about playing online, so we agreed I would take one shot at it. We would deposit $50 and if I lost it I would be done with online poker. If I won I would keep playing. I was working at a Nike shoe store at the time in your typical $8/hr part time college job. Very quickly it became apparent that I could make more money playing online than working part time, even if it was just $12/hr at the time.
What games did you start playing online?
My whole career all I’ve ever played is No Limit Texas Hold’em cash games. I started at .05-.10 online. Back then I had no concept of bankroll management. So I recall more than once sitting down with most or all of my roll at .25-.50. At one point, my initial $50 roll got down to as little as $9 or $10 before I started my upward climb and never looked back. But I was dead serious that if I had lost it all, I would have quit playing. I’m stubborn and when I say something, I follow through with it.
Fortunately I won and kept moving up levels. But back then I didn’t have the tools that I do now. I didn’t read any books, visit any poker forums, pay close attention to bankroll management or use any software. So it was a long learning process as I learned from all my mistakes.
What were your influences that helped you develop as a player?
Honestly, I did it myself. I didn’t read books. I played hands. I didn’t start reading forums until after I had established my success. Training sites and all the other resources have never been a big part of my game. As long as I did well, I kept playing my style. I wanted to keep improving, but as long as my results were strong I didn’t feel the need to prioritize those resources.
It was only when I started to transition to tournaments that I decided I didn’t want to go through the same lengthy process. I wanted to accelerate my improvement in tournaments so now I watch more of the training videos and read books to help my tournament game.
After college you moved to a small town in southern Minnesota. Why did you move there?
My boyfriend and I got married and I was pretty homesick. Minnesota was home to both of us. We grew up like 25 minutes from each other. Our whole family is there.
When in your poker development did your relative interest and ability in poker diverge?
It was pretty early on that we realized that I had a knack for the game, so my husband was fine supporting my career. The funny thing is if you put it all down on paper, he has all the qualities that would make a good poker player. He’s very intelligent, mathematical and analytical. I hate numbers. I’m not super detail oriented. I kind of go with the flow, whatever. For instance, on the Myers Briggs test, only .05% of poker players fall in my category of how they think about things. I’m definitely an oddity in the poker world.
You kept a low profile in the poker world, despite your success, for a long time. What made you decide to emerge from the shadows?
One of the reasons I stayed hidden behind the computer for so long is because I was making a good living doing what I did without dealing with any of the bad stuff that comes from being in the spotlight. It wasn’t so much opening up myself, but also opening up my family as well. People, especially in the virtual world can be say really hurtful things about individuals they don’t even know. At the time I was young and insecure enough that opening myself and my family up to that was pretty daunting. It was easier to just stay hidden. Now, I know I have my families full support and I’m much more confident. For whatever reason, I used to feel inadequate despite the fact that I was winning. That’s not the case anymore, so I am confident I can deal with any negative feedback that comes my way.
Well I guess my first experience in emerging from the shadows came when I started a blog. I realized I had a bigger following than I thought when I’d get all sorts of people telling me they enjoyed following my poker tournament updates on Facebook. People I barely knew had all sorts of questions and seemed really excited to learn so I decided to start a blog. The thing is, in LA or Vegas, knowing someone who plays poker for a living maybe isn’t that uncommon. In small town Minnesota, it’s extremely rare. I appreciate all the support so I figure a blog is a good way to keep my followers in the loop. I am friends with Lana O'Brien, the marketing chief and poker player at CardRunners and she suggested I start my blog there.
How did you get involved in the ‘BOOM’ documentary project?
One day I was locked out of my Full Tilt account and panicked thinking I may have been hacked. So I posted for the first time ever, in the high stakes forum at twoplustwo saying “my name is Danielle, I play high stakes against many of you under ‘dmoongirl.” My account is locked, I don’t know why, can you help?” It happened to be the same day that Ryan Firpo, the director of From Busto to Robusto, came into the forums to announce he would be directing a feature length documentary about online poker and it was being produced by Jay Rosenkrantz and Taylor Caby. He saw my post and contacted me to ask if I truly was a female high stakes online player. When he learned a little bit about me he expressed interest in having me as using me as a subject in the documentary. At first I blew it off, but the names Jay Rosekrantz and Taylor Caby were attached to the project and I knew that they were quality people in the poker world. I talked to my husband and family about it and together we decided it would be a good opportunity to educate people about what I do. I sometimes feel like poker players get a bad reputation because they only time they seem to be represented in the media is when they are doing stupid stuff or spending ridiculous amounts of money on lavish lifestyles. I wanted to fight the negative perceptions that exist about poker players and contribute my part to the story.
Has your husband been supportive of your poker journey?
He’s been amazing. I would have quit a long time ago if not for him. Poker is an emotional roller coaster and I’ve had times where I’ve hit rock bottom and he’s always there for me picking me up. There was a time in my poker career where I let poker dictate my mood and it wasn’t fun for him to deal with my emotional swings but he stuck by me. He’s a teacher and a coach and he’s one of those unique people who truly doesn’t care much about money. I think he sometimes secretly wanted me to quit poker and get a less stressful, worse paying job but he knows I love the game and he wants me to accomplish my goals. My husband is truly my best friend in the world. He’s also an amazing father. So even though I always miss my son when traveling, I never have to worry about him.
Can you share some details about the swings you’ve gone through?
Well, this was likely a one time thing, but I once played 13 hands of $500/$1000 against Phil Ivey and this one huge huge fish I was chasing. Phil ended up busting him, but I got some of his money so it was an interesting experience. That’s obviously a much higher limit than I usually play and I’m much better about managing my bankroll than when I started in poker, but I don’t mind taking a shot when I see a good situation.
As for my regular game before online poker in the U.S. was severely impact on April 15th, my standard game was $25-$50 NLHE 6-max. I also played a fair amount of CAP games. So the buy-ins range from $2,000 at the shallow tables and $5,000 at the normal ones.
I don’t like to get into too many details of my results, and I honestly don’t remember the daily best upswings or downswings I’ve had but there was one really big fish who enjoyed playing me at high stakes heads-up. I played some $200-$400 with him, so those sessions definitely account for my biggest wins and losses. I sold off some of my action, but I definitely came out ahead in the matches.
It’s strange, but in the poker world you disassociate with the value of the money. It’s just chips. If someone were to come to my house and steal money from me, I’d be devastated but when I lose it online it doesn’t feel the same. Of course losing ‘chips” still hurts, but I think you have to sort of ‘numb’ yourself to mentally survive.
What excites you about poker at this point?
I love the game. I like being good at something. I try not to be too results oriented, but sometimes it’s hard not to be. The hardest thing to deal with is when I’m disappointed with my decision making. That’s worse than actually losing. For example, if I kept playing when I know I shouldn’t have. Or I opted to gamble without justifiable odds just because I’m frustrated or tilted. As my career has progressed those things happen less and less but I take it hard when they do.
Do you use a HUD? Hold’em Manager? Other software?
I use a HUD but my husband is the tech whiz who handles my importing of hands and hand analysis set up. Anything technical he sets up and explains to me. I’m less reliant on the information than other high stakes players, but I do use it. I’m more of an intuitive player and I find the numbers can be misleading at times. I can sense the flow of the game well, something the numbers don’t usually reliably indicate.
So what is in your immediate future in poker?
Right now I’m in a very tough spot, as my bankroll is still stuck on Full Tilt Poker. Without online poker, I don’t have a job and I’ve been forced to make some tough decisions.
It’s just terrible timing because I was starting to get serious with my tournament game and now I’m not sure what type of opportunities I will have to play them. I’m in a sticky situation because I don’t feel I can move with my family well established in Minnesota. I want what’s best for my son and being in Minnesota is ideal for him with family around. If some major opportunity came up that required me to move we’d at least temporarily consider it but for now, Minnesota is the best place for us. Unfortunately Minnesota only spreads live Limit Hold’em games so playing live locally isn’t really an option for me.
I’m planning to spend one week a month playing live cash games in L.A. at the Commerce or in Vegas and spending the rest of the time at home. I plan on grinding hard long days (12-14 hours) while on those trips to try to get in as much volume as possible. I’ll probably play $10-$20 NLHE as that’s a very regular game there that plays pretty deep. I’ve set up a temporary backing arrangement to get me started with someone I trust and consider a poker mentor.
The entire Black Friday situation has scarred me. I became accustomed to not being worried about what something cost. If I wanted something reasonable, I got it. But now, things are that much tighter and more uncertain. It ripped the rug out from my foundation of financial security. I’m not particularly materialistic and I don’t need designer clothes, bags, whatever, but since Black Friday I’ve had to be very careful with my money and it’s been pretty stressful. So even when I get back that Full Tilt money, I almost feel like I want to lock that up in my bank account and not put that money in play or risk it again to avoid this situation ever happening again. Maybe that feeling will pass in time but for now, I’m happy to take a pay cut right now, by being backed, to decrease the variance and stress.
Have you played at the Commerce before?
Yes, I played a few days before I flew out to Las Vegas for the WSOP. Being results oriented, it didn’t go so well. But I also saw that there are many profitable opportunities for when I can play more volume. I left there feeling more optimistic about playing live than when I first arrived. I feel like I have a big edge that will show over time.
If that plan doesn’t work, plan B is to get a nursing job and use the degree I earned in college. It’s not where my dreams and goals are, but if that’s what ends up being best for myself and my family, I’ll do it.
How has the transition from online to live poker gone for you?
It’s gone alright. Something I need to improve upon is I’m a little more hesitant to make big plays. It’s a little more daunting to show down a 10 high bluff live than it is online. But on the other hand, I have other strengths that play better live, like being a woman, that doesn’t help me online. With time and experience I think my live game will make big strides too.
Have you played in the World Series of Poker before?
I played a couple of events last year. The 2010 Main Event was my first big buy-in event and I felt I wasn’t really prepared for it. I felt a little overwhelmed by the experience.
This year, while I only played three events during the WSOP, I felt much more prepared and confident. I would have liked to play more events, but I don’t have the money available right now and I’m limited in how long I can be away from home.
Even though I busted on Day 2 of the WSOP, I felt confident in my game and competing with the other players at my table. I tangled with the big stack at my table in a tough spot where he was opening up a lot of pots light and just happened to have the top of his range on the hand I played back at him. I feel at peace with how I played.
Are you enjoying the attention you are beginning to receive now in poker?
Yes, while the attention can be kind of intimidating, I have to admit it’s flattering. The attention sort of validates all my hard work. When I was hiding behind the curtain, I didn’t get the feedback. When people see me now and say “that’s dmoongirl” they tend to be surprised and mostly impressed a female could tangle with the high stakes players on FullTilt.
As I mentioned, I don’t feel very financially secure after Black Friday. The attention I have gotten has allowed me to do some networking and has opened up the doors to some opportunities that might help me support my family.
Have you ever coached other players?
As I expressed earlier, my game is very intuitive and thus makes it hard to communicate my edge. If it were that easy to pass on, I would have taught my husband or close friends. Each person needs to put in the time and see how they fare. It’s one of the reasons I don’t participate on the forums very much. I don’t communicate in the same exact and precise analytical way that other poker players do. For me, it’s more about feel. You just have to get in there and do it. Sometimes I don’t know why it’s right to make a move, but I know I should. In the past, that was confusing to me, and lead to some insecurity about my poker skills but I’ve finally come to peace with it.
How does your poker style fit in with your personality?
My style is patiently aggressive. I’m outgoing and friendly but very competitive. I’ve always been into sports. It fits in line with who I am as a person to be aggressive at the poker table. I think my natural tendencies in poker are more innate than taught. Since I was a child, I had that feisty spirit that comes in handy at poker. It’s apparent that I can be stubborn and I strive to succeed in everything I do. When you want to win at poker, being determined really makes a difference.
What advice would you pass on players aspiring in poker?
First of all I’d warn them that It’s really hard. I honestly don’t really recommend it for most people. You have to be extremely disciplined and ready to handle the inevitable highs and brutal lows of poker. After that warning I’d tell them to use the resources available to them.
I learned a lot of lessons the hard way, but there’s no reason for that. There is a ton of free and reasonably priced information that will speed you along on your poker journey. Take advantage of the tools you have. In retrospect, I realize if I had paid attention to that information when I was first starting out, I would have accelerated my learning and results and be further along my poker path. My biggest advice would be to learn about variance and understand it is inevitable to have upswings and downswings in poker. Don’t let your emotions get the best of you. I look back now at how upset I used to get and I just realize it was a big waste of time and energy. Variance happens, learning how to deal with it will relieve a great amount of stress.
What changed?
I’d say my son being born in 2007 was really the turning point for me with regards to controlling emotion in poker. It’s not fair to him to be crabby just because I had a bad day in poker so I really work hard to rein that in. Before he was born I was pretty lazy. I was playing 20 hours a week and making a good living so I wasn’t motivated to work hard. After he was born I became really motivated to provide for my family so I started to treat poker more like a job. I put more hours in and worked a more routine schedule. Unfortunately by that time the games had gotten a lot tougher so I guess I kind of missed out. Like everyone else, I had to adjust and adapt.
So you’ve enjoyed your WSOP trip and meeting more poker people?
Yes. Poker is unique. It brings together so many different kinds of people. Playing online, it’s easy to think that most players are socially awkward nerds but in reality poker has some of the most fascinating, intelligent, awesome individuals you will ever meet. I’ve made some great friends this WSOP and I’m already looking forward to coming back next year for a big reunion.
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