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Gold Graph vs Exp Graph

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#1 pr0tential

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 01:56 AM

Which do you guys think is more important?

For example big pushing comps that take early towers will be up in gold but will fall behind in exp. Obviously there are many other factors to consider but in the big picture which graph would you rather be dominating?
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#2 7_ShininGAngel

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 05:13 AM

Really depends on the game and the line-ups.
For example if you take a pushing line-up vs a turtling one;
Obviously for the turtle line up gold graph won't be that important early on but being able to successfully defend and that will mean a higher XP graph if they are able to stop the pushes.
One or two successful defendings, and the gold graph means very less, because they will start to take some towers and start to equalize the gold graph aswell, they will basically win the game even if they are behind in gold.
That's why teams like mTw are very careful before pushing in, even though they have like 20k gold advantage. Because basically one failpush and the gold advantage won't even matter as the game might turn around.
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#3 yoshi-

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 05:53 AM

Exp graph is 99% of the time just useless.

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#4 Fr3akad3ll3

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 08:40 AM

the graphes give imformation about where the game went up to that point, not where it will go afterwards ...

ofc it pictures an advantage for either team, but wether ot not they screw up the next fight is still unknown ...

it more likely to win the next teamfight with a gold advantage in early game because of the advantage in teamfight items such as mekka or pipe, but in mid-lategame the team with a lead in the exp graph is in the better position, because they are more powerfull overall and some heroes require a high lvl over many items to shine ...
ofc some people will think that its exactly the opposite (early exp lategame gold) and they have a point but either way i think the graphes are just able to show where the game has been
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#5 Crown1

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 08:55 AM

what #3 said, and gold graph could be very misleading sometimes, for example all year team buys back for a fight,-> -5k gold, but this will not show in the gold graph since the gold showed on gold graphs is the gold gained by a team, not the worth of the items in your inventory+gold in bank
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#6 Vertigo

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 09:43 AM

So I have this thing on my mind for some time now, but I haven't had the chance to post it anywhere (maybe I should try dev.dota forums).

What I'm saying is that basically a secondary gold graph should be implemented, which shows the difference in gold earned by the two teams in percentages. For example if - let's say by minute 10 - Radiant has farmed 10k gold and Dire has farmed 13k gold, then the Dire has a 30% lead.

This doesn't sound too intriguing so far, does it? Here comes the interesting part: at the later stages of the game, when for example a pushing line-up team has accumulated a good 15k gold lead in 45 minutes, but the other team manages to turtle enough into late game, the regular goldgraph usually evens out if there are no raxes down. So it flattens and stays levelled on 15k and won't move till the next big teamfight, Roshan fight, etc.
While using the above mentioned idea, the 45 min gold lead comes from a 80k-95k gold difference (18,75%), 15 minutes later it might still be 15k with different figures, e.g. 100k-115k (15%). So the gap between the teams is in fact narrowing although the currently used gold graph stays the same.

This might be the gold graph to look out for. Obviously not replacing the old one, the two could be present at the same time.
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#7 Vertigo

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 09:51 AM

One more thing about the xp graph. It's interesting to watch and probably more reliable than the gold graph (because deaths and rebuys are not calculated in the latter one) for like 50-55 minutes into the game. After that it eventually becomes completely useless.
Once a hero on either side reaches lvl 25 and won't gain any exp anymore, the xp graph will slowly but steadily dive/rise in favour of the other team. At one point, when all the heroes are lvl 25 (kinda rare) it reaches zero and won't ever move again, so it is only worth watching in the early-mid game.
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#8 Alyyx20Jeanette

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 01:07 PM

The only rules you can derive from graphs are if they are constantly going in one team's favour. Since then it's that team winning almost 100%. (talking about top teams).
Otherwise it's useless.
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#9 ggnet.s

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 10:07 AM

gold graph.

IMO, the graph gives information about how much gold advantages that a team have and farming rate for a team.
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#10 BTS.GoDz

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 10:46 AM

Have to look at both in context; neither should be relied on, you are better looking at the actual game state, who has more map control, what are the actual hero LEVELS (xp graph just is a reflection of this, instead of looking at some pointless numbers, look at the numbers that matter - what level are heroes. what spells/stat growth do they have) . As forr gold, well sometimes you can be ahead but thats what a lineup is meant to do (ie: a very aggressive enchantress early push draft), doesnt mean you are necessarily leading, just the way a lineup is meant to function.

Similarly, look at ITEMS not gold difference (items is just a reflection of who is leading in gold graph, and is more relevent than looking at some big numbers on a graph)
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